Re: [Harp-L] chrom-style bends on a valved diatonic?

[Philharpn@xxxxxxx]

You can achieve chrome style bends ONLY on a VALVED diatonic.

There are at least two kinds of bends on a harmonica. 
 Single reed bends and 
   double reed bends.

The bends most commonly talked about are the Double Reed Bends on a diatonic 
or blues harp. If you draw on hole No. 1 and bend it down a half step to Dd or 
C# (two names for same note) the bend starts on the draw reed but finishes up 
on the blow reed. In other words the Draw 1 (D) can be bent down to Db. When 
two reeds "interact" the bend is the distance between the two reeds.

The chromatic has windsavers also called valves on most of its reeds. (I 
think the high reeds don"t --but I don't have time to check)

The Suzuki ProMaster 350V (valved) and the Hohner Slide Harp are half valved, 
meaning they have windsavers/valves on the draw reed plate. Both the 
ProMaster and Slide Harp are richter tuned (like the Marine Band layout. It is the 
valves that enable single-reed bends; not the richter layout. 

What this means that you can blow bend the Hole No. 1 C down a half step to a 
B on the ProMaster, Slide Harp and valved chromatics. This is a single reed 
bend. The valves block the interaction between the two reeds.

I believe Seydel makes an unvalved/windsaverless 12-hole chromatic for the 
main reason of eliminating all the issues from stuck/clogged windsavers. Anyone 
buying that harp thinking it will bend like a blues harp will be disappointed. 
Without the windsavers the chrome will bend a half-step from Hole 1 Draw D to 
Db, Hole 3 a half-step from A to Ab. That is because Hole 1 (Blow C,Draw D 
and all other similar holes) and Hole 3 (Blow G Draw A and similar) are the only 
two   hole-combinations that allow bending. The other two hole combinations 
-- Blow E, Draw F and C blow and B draw -- have no notes between the blow and 
draw reed, so no double reed bend is possible.


This question came up at SPAH when a talented young (a lot younger than I am) 
man observed that he was going to take the windsavers off his chromatic so he 
could bend. I assured him he would not get much bending and a real leaky 
harp.

As to putting valves on solo tuned diatonic there are several problems.
* First you have to find a solo-tuned diatonic 
* They only come in the key of C
* And why bother to hunt one up and then paste valves on it when you could 
buy an inexpensive chrome that already has valves. Just ignore the button, like 
the old-time blues guys did.

(Hohner still makes a 12-hole solo tuned Marine Band in C, list price $49; 
Huang makes a 12-hole solo tuned harp in C with a list price of $7.95 (I found 
it listed on http://www.superdupermusic.com/harmonica/2370200.html
There is a lot of misinformation floating around regarding valves. You don't 
need to understand the physics of it, just the two kinds of bends and that the 
twain mostly never meet.

Also check the Harp-l archives, this chestnut has been around the park a few 
times.

Hope this helps.
Phil Lloyd



In a message dated 8/21/07 9:23:43 AM, howbah@xxxxxxxxx writes:


> I read somewhere that, on a chromatic, (a) any note can be bent down a 
> half-step, and that (b) this was because all the notes were valved.
>   
>   If this is true, then what if you got a solo tuned diatonic and put valves 
> on all the notes - would that give you a harp that could play all the notes 
> of the chromatic scale?  That would be a lot easier for richter players to 
> adjust to - to flat a note just bend it, instead of going back one hole and 
> hitting the sharping button.
>   
>   (And hey, If it's not true that the valves affect bending on a chromatic 
> as I read they did, please let me know!)
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